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Hi Mivkz,
This link is to a blog maintained by a Multiple Myeloma patient who has collected a huge number of studies about curcumin, the active ingredient in turmeric. I guess when you state that you are taking "3 per day" it would be helpful if you said how many milligrams each tab? capsule? pill? you are taking is. Anyway, you might enjoy perusing Margaret's site, there are a number of discussions about curcumin on the right side of her blog page. http://margaret.healthblogs.org/
Hope this helps.
- WBF
Hi WBF - I take 500 mg capsules, 3 per day. Thanks for giving me the link to Margaret's site. Looks like a lot of good info there.
Greetings
This is one of my favorite topics.. natural ways to boost immune system to fight off the DX..
I think you answered your own question by taking turmeric then stopping and then starting up taking
the Trumeric again. By doing this you notice nodes got smaller. You have your own home trial going on.
good job. and ... good luck
keep us updated with your success.
Thanks Goodchatt. I have been doing a lot of research on natural ways to combat this disease. Always good to hear what everyone is doing. I check this site daily.
Thanks for the Tumeric info. I've been taking green tea suppliments after reading a Mayo Clinic study of CLL patients. One caution on Green Tea is that it contains some level of caffeine, even if it's not marked on the bottle. I kept wondering why I felt so peppy, even at 11:00 at night. I've switched to decaf suppliments and I sleep much better at night.
Hi Mdmom,
You can also take a supplement called EGCG, which is the active ingredient in green tea, and I don't think it contains caffeine. I have a copy of an interesting study about both the curcumin and the EGCG - if anyone's interested they can send me a private message and I'll make arrangements to email it.
- WBF
Hi,
I am a total newbie, so please keep that in mind!
But I've been reading about cancer-fighting foods like a banshee, and I read that it's important to take turmeric with pepper... they think that's why Indians don't have as much cancer, because they eat it in curry, but in conjunction with pepper...
You might want to google and investigate that point. Right now I take my turmeric supplements in a glass of water into which I put ground black pepper... crazy, I know, but I just got diagnosed and doing EVERYTHING I can to beat this thing!!!
Similarly I read you can't get the benefits of lycopene from eating cold tomatoes, they have to be cooked, and taken with olive oil to aid absorption into the body.
Hope that helps, and remember, I'M NO EXPERT, and this is just a suggestion to look into...
Best regards,
Maria
mkr
I agree with you... I take many of those type herbs and spices... I call it my own home treatment trial..
I just had a doc visit.. and blood work... my blood work is hanging in there.. my nodes are okay still
I hope we both have found something that may slow this stuff.. down some
This is all new to me as well.. I just happen to read about these types of cancer options.. and started
my own home trials.. little of this little of that.. till I got some balance for my body... that seems to keep me
getting up each day.. feeling okay.. I will take every good day I get..
good luck to you.. keep us posted.. I go back to my doctor in 6 months... wow..
One day at a time...
Hi mkr,
You can actually buy a curcumin/piperine supplement (curcumin being the active component of turmeric, and piperine = pepper) - I'm just thinking using such a product might reduce the gag potential of the concoction you've been consuming! You might also check out the discussions relating to the bioavailability of curcumin (which is enhanced by adding piperine) on the links I'm providing...if you're interested in this stuff, you may well find these an interesting read. http://margaret.healthblogs.org/life-with-myeloma/discovery-of-curcumin/bioavailability-of-curcumin/piperine/
http://margaret.healthblogs.org/life-with-myeloma/discovery-of-curcumin/bioavailability-of-curcumin/
Best wishes,
- WBF
I READ THAT USING TURMERIC ALONG WITH GREEN TEA IS COUNTER PRODUCTIVE IN
CASE YOU ARE ALSO USING GREEN TEA.
On Sat, 21 Aug 2010 17:50:40 -0400 mkr <communityreply@lls.org> writes:
blue,
A new message was posted in the thread "How Much Turmeric Should I
Take?":
Author : mkr
Profile : http://community.lls.org/people/mkr
Message:
Where did you read that?? Can you please send a link?
Thanks,
Maria
WILL TRY TO FIND WHEN i GET A CHANCE BUT MY DOC WHO IS BIG GREEN TEA MAN
SAYS HE WOULDN'T TAKE THEM TOGETHER.
WILL LOOK FOR THE LINK OR ONE OF THEM......HAVE READ IT MANY TIMES AND
THAT WAS THE REASON I ASKED MY DOC.
On Sat, 21 Aug 2010 18:38:47 -0400 mkr <communityreply@lls.org> writes:
blue,
A new message was posted in the thread "How Much Turmeric Should I
Take?":
Author : mkr
Profile : http://community.lls.org/people/mkr
Message:
Does that mean you can take them a few hours apart, or not together at
all?
Sent from my iPhone
I WOULD JUST ASK YOUR DOC AND SEE WHAT HE SAYS.........
On Sat, 21 Aug 2010 18:38:47 -0400 mkr <communityreply@lls.org> writes:
blue,
A new message was posted in the thread "How Much Turmeric Should I
Take?":
Author : mkr
Profile : http://community.lls.org/people/mkr
Message:
Hi Blue,
The report I referred to above says in part, "Treatment of primary B-CLL cells with the combination of EGCG and curcurmin was investigated. The sequential administration of EGCG followed by curcumin was the most effective treatment combination, whereas simultaneous administration resulted in antagonistic effects." It goes on to state, "The data also indicate that sequential treatment of B-CLL with EGCG followed by curcumin is preferable to simultaneous treatment and is crucial to the efficacy of the combination of there two compounds." This report was published in Clinical Cancer Research in 2009. Interesting stuff.
- WBF
Hi Blue,
The report I referred to above says in part, "Treatment of primary B-CLL cells with the combination of EGCG and curcurmin was investigated. The sequential administration of EGCG followed by curcumin was the most effective treatment combination, whereas simultaneous administration resulted in antagonistic effects." It goes on to state, "The data also indicate that sequential treatment of B-CLL with EGCG followed by curcumin is preferable to simultaneous treatment and is crucial to the efficacy of the combination of there two compounds." This report was published in Clinical Cancer Research in 2009. Interesting stuff.
- WBF
Hi Blue,
The report I referred to above says in part, "Treatment of primary B-CLL cells with the combination of EGCG and curcurmin was investigated. The sequential administration of EGCG followed by curcumin was the most effective treatment combination, whereas simultaneous administration resulted in antagonistic effects." It goes on to state, "The data also indicate that sequential treatment of B-CLL with EGCG followed by curcumin is preferable to simultaneous treatment and is crucial to the efficacy of the combination of there two compounds." This report was published in Clinical Cancer Research in 2009. Interesting stuff.
- WBF
Sorry for the duplicate posts - the website seems to be in a capricious mood tonight!
- WBF
I read that also. I wish they were a little more specific about how sequential they were. Take one in the morning and the other at night? Alternate days, or weeks? I have been taking them together, so I guess I'll stop that! My counts have also been going up, so maybe that's why!
Tumerric(cucurmin) and Green Tea.
Read this article.
http://clincancerres.aacrjournals.org/content/15/4/1123.full
Seems that taking them together might not be such a good idea. Seems that taking the Green Tea first then the Cucurmin has the best effect.
I take Green Tea during the day-then take 2x tablets of the cucurmin at night before bed. I take this formula http://www.cncahealth.com/herbs/curcumin-750mg
Late in on this topic, but here is further information on the study (one is a commentary on the study). Looks like 24 hours according to the study methods, but this is just how they did the study, they didn't test different time intervals to see if shorter produces the same results, plus they washed between administrations. The third reference below gives some concentration times and values (see Table 2. & Figure 2) for green tea - maybe shorter intervals between could produce the same results?
Curcumin Inhibits Prosurvival Pathways in Chronic Lymphocytic Leukemia B Cells and May Overcome Their Stromal Protection in Combination with EGCG
Asish K. Ghosh, Neil E. Kay, Charla R. Secreto, et all
Clin Cancer Res 2009;15:1250-1258.
http://clincancerres.aacrjournals.org/content/15/4/1250.full.pdf+html
Materials and Methods pg. 1252
"For sequential treatment experiments, 1.0 x 106 CLL B cells/mL were treated with DMSO, curcumin (10 umol/L) alone, EGCG (100 umol/L) alone, or both agents for 24h; washed; and cultured for another 24h in media alone or with the addition of the second agent (EGCG or curcumin), as indicated.
Tumeric and Green Tea: A recipe for the Treatment of B-Chronic Lymphocytic Leukemia
Commentary on Ghosh et al., p.1250
Laura S. Angelo and Razelle Kurzrock
Clin Cancer Res 2009;1123 15(4) February 15, 2009
http://clincancerres.aacrjournals.org/content/15/4/1123.full.pdf+html
Bioavailability and antioxidant activity of tea flavanols after consumption of green tea, black tea, or a green tea extract supplement 1-3
http://www.ajcn.org/content/80/6/1558.full.pdf
How relevant are the first study's results?
The concentrations they used most often were 40uM ECGC and 20uM Curcumin, even at 5 uM curcumin, one of the Figures (9) shows no inhibition of one of the markers they looked at. They state: "Our present studies, in contrast, demonstrate opposing effects of these agents. Unlike EGCG, curcumin treatment does not increase hINV promoter activity or increase endogenous hINV expression. Moreover, curcumin, at concentrations > 15uM, inhibits the EGCG-dependent increase important in hINV promoter activity. This appears to be physiologically important, since curcumin also inhibits the EGCG-dependent increase in endogenous incolucrin level."
But if you look at plasma/tissue levels of curcumin from: Bioavailability of Curcumin: Problems and Promises Preetha Anand, Ajaikumar B. Kunnumakkara, Robert A. Newman, and Bharat B. Aggarwal. Mol. Pharmaceutics, 2007, 4 (6), 807-818. http://www.curcuminresearch.org/PDF/Anand%20P-23.pdf , how many people are taking doses or curcumin that high, and it looks like they wouldn't even be reaching the levels of the sequential treatments. Is this accurate?
Table 1. (page 811)
Species route dose plasma/tissue levels
human oral 2g/kg serum 0.006+ 0.005 ug/mL (Micro Grams per MilliLiter)
human oral 4-8 g serum 0.4-3.6 uM (MicroMole)
human oral 10 g serum 50.5 ng/m (NanoGram per ?)
human oral 12 g serum 51.2 ng/mL (NanoGrams per MilliLiter)
human oral 3.6 g plasma 11.1 + 0.6 nmol/mL (NanoMole per MilliLiter)
human oral 0.4-3.6 g colorectum 7-20 mol's (Moles)
Anyone is welcome to sort this our more completely, as I could be missing some details, affecting accuracy.
Curcumin can have side effects and interact with other drugs. Best to discuss its use with your haematologist. Source - Spanish Article...2010 http://personal.us.es/mlopezlazaro/2010.%20Int%20J%20Cancer.%20The%20dark%20side%20of%20curcumin.pdf and http://www.mdpi.com/2072-6651/2/1/128/pdf ~chris
The term "limited bioavailability" is key here. This article sounds like others I have read. Curcumin looks promising in vitro (in a petri dish in a lab) but that sucess hasn't transferred to humans. Even if you take bioprene with curcumin, it doesn't look like the body can absorb it. I've been taking curcumin with bioprene (it's supposed to help absorption), but now I'm wondering if this is really doing anything other than keeping my vitiamin retailer in business. This looks like a prmising area of research, but probablly not something that will help now.
